BoaterTalk: Forum: Liquid Lounge

From past cases, I say the case is a slam dunk for the Catholics

Forum: Liquid Lounge

news

Catholics take it up a notch... rlhartman New

Whether you agree with them or not, the first amendment kind of gives them a big boost on this one.

gack

What a messed up country we live, where your employer decides what medical care is accessible to you 20yrboater New

feedback

Don't work for the Catholic Church then. lrcable New

doh

Great, I'm a Jehova Witness, we don't believe in blood being drawn so I won't pay for blood tests or transfusions <NT> Helly New

more

Well, that is correct, since you wouldn't have it done. <NT> lrcable New

question

So then it's ok for a Jehova Witness owned company not to have to pay for blood or blood tests? <NT> Helly New

more

I think it would be fine for people under the Hall's insurance to not cover transfusion. lrcable New

note

one difference DangerJudy New

note

You think abortion never saves a life? janedoe New

note

Not that you care, but... DangerJudy New

more

There are actually a number of alternatives to blood transfusions lrcable New

angry

Great, live to your belief system, but don't expect me to. Helly New

note

So you advocate eliminating job opportunities? Health care, clean water and clean air aren't optional in democracies. 20yrboater New

feedback

Health coverage from one's employer mostly started after WW2, a relatively recent phenomenon... rlhartman New

note

Sad that the right wing wants to keep employment and health care locked together. Free the private sector. <NT> 20yrboater New

note

Seems the left wing does too. RandyH New

note

The GOP and the lobbyists were the only ones opposed to Goverment and universal health care in '90s <NT> 20yrboater New

th_up

I TOTALLY agree that employment and health care should NOT be tied together. However... rlhartman New

doh

please name one type of "other insurances" rustyboater New

feedback

You'll die without food and shelter, but I don't see you advocating that employers must provide those... rlhartman New

note

wrong. rustyboater New

feedback

Until you stop with the personal "Rovian" garbage it's impossible to have a reasoned discussion with you... rlhartman New

smile

hahahahahaha! rustyboater New

more

And as an aside: You must have a man-crush on Karl Rove. You mention him almost every day. Have you told him? <NT> rlhartman New

smile

show me rustyboater New

note

there is one hole in that argument: Shared risk................... Terrell New

feedback

Agreed, but everyone misses the ROOT CAUSE of this problem... rlhartman New

note

Last time I looked we were a constitutional republic. lrcable New

feedback

likes

2 peterelkon New

smile

you beat me to the punch... likes

likes

1 rustyboater New

more

How would taking less healthcare cost more? lrcable New

smile

Of course they are reaching DangerJudy New

note

Because of the consequences of taking less care of your health. peterelkon New

more

No, you are still reaching. No contraceptives does not equate to no healthcare likes

likes

1 lrcable New

th_up

Larry gets it. He worded it very well. <NT> DangerJudy New

news

Then the church should not be allowed to provide healthcare. Simple. <NT> SirFlipsALot New

note

Huge fines if they do not. DangerJudy New

note

and DangerJudy New

question

So I can start a hospital and not treat STDs because I think its sinful? <NT> SirFlipsALot New

note

Yes why not? <NT> DangerJudy New

disagree

Hah! riverlarken New

note

Is he trying to be? <NT> DangerJudy New

note

he wasn't the one I was referring to <NT> riverlarken New

note

Its a free country DangerJudy New

smile

referring to the constitution is reaching? rustyboater New

more

Just what constitutional amendment guarentees that your employer buys you birth control? lrcable New

doh

nice leap there Larry rustyboater New

more

Again, what individual right is being violated by the Catholics not providing birth control? lrcable New

smile

no one said that either rustyboater New

note

Imagine DangerJudy New

smile

one more time likes

likes

1 rustyboater New

note

"It appears to you as an outsider" DangerJudy New

note

of course they won't riverlarken New

note

Kill em all, let baal sort em out <NT> DangerJudy New

smile

i understand completely rustyboater New

note

You just illustrated by your post DangerJudy New

smile

evidently I should have added... rustyboater New

disagree

Nope DangerJudy New

smile

how many hospitals are where you live? rustyboater New

note

Is that ONE hospital a Catholic Hospital? Teledave New

smile

no...Methodist... rustyboater New

note

Thanks for the answer. Teledave New

th_up

Very well said <NT> rlhartman New

smile

i've got no blood in this... rustyboater New

feedback

There! "If the law did not cover..." The problem in a nutshell! rlhartman New

note

You poor thing DangerJudy New

note

oops, mandate not mandade DangerJudy New

more

And there have ALWAYS been exemptions for certain types of employers and organizations likes

likes

1 lrcable New

smile

those exemptions rustyboater New

note

I don't think it's legal for businesses to discriminately hire on the basis of religious affiliation DangerJudy New

idea

You do understand that you can buy either full or supplemental coverage on your own? RandyH New

disagree

Dumb logic. I'm a cancer survivor and had a corrected heart condition. Wanna sell me some insurance? <NT> Helly New

note

Sure. Wanna pay what I would charge for it? RandyH New

note

And that's just the point. peterelkon New

disagree

Sorry, you're dead wrong. There are many people who "can't" buy insurance at any cost. <NT> likes

likes

1 Helly New

note

Are you trying to tell me that if you offered to pay $1M for a health insurance policy... RandyH New

note

Is that a realistic argument? If I could afford a million dollar policy I wouldn't need insurance, would I? <NT> Helly New

note

It is about as realistic as asking for somebody to give you a policy for less than what it costs them. <NT> RandyH New

note

Free contraceptives easy to find no insurance required <NT> DangerJudy New

doh

I can find you a free car too, just not the same value as one that works the way it should. <NT> dangore New

disagree

Same meds, same condoms, same everything, free, easy to find <NT> likes

likes

-2 DangerJudy New

disagree

Simply not true!....I know this for fact from family experience <NT> dangore New

note

Do tell <NT> DangerJudy New

gack

If you cannot figure out that the different pills.... dangore New

smile

Talk with her I think you mean <NT> DangerJudy New

disagree

Ever heard of prexisting conditions? And major medical policies which are incomplete coverage? 20yrboater New

note

I want Obamacare repealed, but not have our old health care system... likes

likes

-1 RandyH New

idea

I think employers should be free to offer whatever benefits they wish, and you should be free to choose where to work... rlhartman New

doh

nice vaccuum... likes

likes

1 rustyboater New

feedback

I am free to apply where I wish, and I'm free to quit anytime. Slavery was abolished a while back, y'know. rlhartman New

smile

because everybody doesn't have the same choices likes

likes

1 rustyboater New

feedback

Nor does everyone require babysitting. Why do you insist that everyone be reduced to the least common denominator? rlhartman New

smile

still clueless I see... rustyboater New

feedback

So are you in favor of choice, or not?!? rlhartman New

smile

you're so far away from the original subject this is meaningless likes

likes

3 rustyboater New

note

Correct. Its the same kind of thinking as the Court declaring that corporations can anonymously fund voting ads 20yrboater New

note

and everyone free to go without health coverage puts their cost burden on everyone else <NT> 20yrboater New

note

That's because gov't has corrupted the health care system by requiring treatment for those without coverage... likes

likes

1 rlhartman New

note

You know, the Dutch have accomplished that rather nicely, and pretty close to universally. peterelkon New

feedback

Your description sounds promising. I'm interested. rlhartman New

note

It's dumb that GOP wants to keep employment and health care tied together.Separate them, like other developed countries <NT> 20yrboater New

th_up

I TOTALLY agree that employment and health care should NOT be tied together. However... likes

likes

1 rlhartman New

note

A Government health care program (w coverage for all at small cost) would allow this. Wish we had it. <NT> likes

likes

1 20yrboater New

feedback

No, simply replacing the role of the employer with gov't is no improvement. rlhartman New

note

Government health care coverage would eliminate the profit thereby reducing costs significantly 20yrboater New

note

I'm no lawyer but I think the church will lose big in court of public opinion likes

likes

1 SwimmerBill New

smile

Is this the first time you've noticed that the Catholic Church is extremely socially conservative? lrcable New

note

Change that to the hierarchy of the Catholic Church. likes

likes

1 otto New

smile

Gates of hell shall not prevail DangerJudy New

smile

Well, it does in Alabama. peterelkon New

smile

Oh no! DangerJudy New

note

Is freedom of religion an individual or group right? SwimmerBill New

smile

Yes DangerJudy New

note

Yawn. otto New

note

Making personal attacks never wins debates <NT> DangerJudy New

note

Sadly it is the laying out of facts that fails to win debates. <NT> otto New

note

All you have to do is make one factual comment about the Catholic church.... likes

likes

1 dangore New

smile

Maybe we should look at that coexist sticker some more <NT> DangerJudy New

smile

Yes the Catholic church should....so far they have failed to grasp it. <NT> dangore New

smile

You're the one on here spewing vitriol. DangerJudy New

smile

You have not heard vitriol..... dangore New

note

It sure reads like it to me DangerJudy New

note

I would hope you would read very angry at religions that stand in the way of humanity.... dangore New

note

Yes you are angry. I am sorry. <NT> DangerJudy New

th_up

love love riverlarken New

note

Line them up against the wall DangerJudy New

smile

maybe we should. peterelkon New

note

Good luck with that. <NT> DangerJudy New

smile

Eh, there's always prayer. <NT> peterelkon New

idea

We're arguing about whether churches should be treated "special"... rlhartman New

note

It does have to be different.... dangore New

smile

Since when is free contraception = health care? DangerJudy New

question

Since when does it not? <NT> dangore New

note

It's never been defined that way before. <NT> DangerJudy New

note

It's alway been defined that way..... dangore New

feedback

Like all institutions throughout history, including gov'ts and churches... likes

likes

1 rlhartman New

note

You are getting angry DangerJudy New

sad

Once again you ignore all the health benefits of the different forms of contraception. dangore New

note

and you ignore the health detriments DangerJudy New

feedback

Speaking for me personally, I don't see it that way... likes

likes

1 rlhartman New

note

you are certainly free to not offer health insurance but not to forbid others to offer it SwimmerBill New

feedback

You're correct, but if we believe that the gov't can mandate employer healthcare coverage... likes

likes

1 rlhartman New

note

As I read it you are calling for fewer players and choices? SwimmerBill New

note

You assert: Birth control = Abortion? SwimmerBill New

note

No. DangerJudy New

th_up

Court will not advocate for a discriminatory policy by an employer <NT> 20yrboater New

smile

here's a scenario... rustyboater New

more

I think it would depend on if they operated it as a for profit or a non-profit organization. lrcable New

smile

that has nothing to do with it... rustyboater New

note

Yes they are going to take over the world <NT> DangerJudy New

note

Yes they are going to take over the world <NT> DangerJudy New

smile

that already happened... rustyboater New

feedback

"When religion ruled the earth, it was called the Dark Ages" <NT> rlhartman New

sad

And we are still fighting off the dark ages as eveidence by this on-going thread! <NT> dangore New

th_up

I wholeheartedly agree! But that doesn't necessarily mean we should throw the baby out with the bathwater. rlhartman New

note

Yes church plans to buy auto makers likes

likes

1 DangerJudy New

th_up

good sarcastic response to a totally moronic scenario <NT> peterj New

smile

you should know <NT> rustyboater New

disagree

Only if they come up with a completely new legal argument zahadum New

smile

We shall see. <NT> DangerJudy New

feedback

Not saying they can't win. zahadum New

smile

We shall see. <NT> DangerJudy New

Forums BoaterTalk Bugs and Suggestions Liquid Lounge Lost and Found Planner RaftZone SurfZone What's SUP

ICF World Championships